Talk:Bible (Wikisource)/Matthew

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Contents 1 Sources 2 Progress report 3 Matthew 5:3-12 4 Matthew 9:38 5 Matthew 20-28 6 Matthew 13-19 7 Matthew 15:18 8 Matthew 5:5 9 Time to move to completed book status 10 Matthew 6:27

[edit] Sources

Matthew 1-9, sources are unknown.

For Matthew 10-12, which I'm translating, I used Robinson-Pierpont's Greek Text as the basis. For comparison, I looked at a variety of English Translations, including the King James, Young's Literal Translation, Darby's Literal Translation, and Walter Porter's Conservative Version.Fontwords 18:34, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

It looks, based on the length of time Matthew 1-9 has been up, that no one is going to come forth with source information. Should we clear these chapters because of possible copyright issues and redo them, or should we just leave them be a bit longer? Fontwords 15:51, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

I can post my version of Matthew 1-9, if that's what people want. Let me know... Jonathan Jonathan Gallagher 13:04, 4 June 2008 (UTC))

Yes, that would be great Jonathan! I think Fontwords is right, and we are never going to find any source info on it.--Jdavid2008 18:45, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Please wait. These chapters were the first added to the project, as far as I can see, so I wouldnt like to see them "replaced" unless it is believed that they are copyright violations. It looks like the contributor is active on Wikipedia, so I have asked the contributor to get in contact with us.[1] John Vandenberg ^(chat) 03:40, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Just checked in and saw the invitation to replace Matt. 1-9. Then saw the above. Are we still waiting, or do we want to move ahead? Jonathan Gallagher (talk) 10:47, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

No, we are no longer waiting. John's been trying to contact him since June, and I have tried long before then.--Jdavid2008 (talk) 22:52, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

In that case I have just uploaded my translation of Matt 1-9 as requested. The same sources as previously apply--just the Nestle-Aland Greek NT. Have not done the formatting, and I'm sure there are some typos/glitches that will need fixing. Jonathan Gallagher (talk) 22:48, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Oh, I'm sure the footnoting is shot too! Jonathan Gallagher (talk) 22:50, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Progress report

I worked a little on this passage (which I thought was a good translation, by the way):

I added verse numbers and subject headings, both which I find very helpful for bible study and, of course, translation.

I did light editing of chapters one to six but tried to respect translation decisions and not change anything major.

I fixed some tense issues for better English. I also tried cut down on so many sentences starting with conjunctions which is generally to be avoided in English. --cAlan 05:14, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Shouldn't "GENEALOGY OF JESUS" read "GENEALOGY OF JOSEPH"? - the Gospel doesn't claim that Joesph was Jesus's father.Lo2u 22:20, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

OK ignore that comment. I didn't read the chapters properly.Lo2u15:30, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

I added again the accidentally deleted Chapter 9, and part of Chapter 8, and am going through and standardizing the verse numbers according to the new system. I'm also putting the headings in lowercase. I also changed Genealogy of Jesus to Genealogy of Joseph--hopefully that's ok with everybody. There was one edit in Chapter Nine: "^9.20And look, a woman who had a discharge of blood for twelve years approached from behind and touched the fringe of his prayer shawl, ^9.21for she said to herself, "If only I may touch his prayer shawl, I will be saved."" that I did not transfer. If people think it should be changed they can do so--I haven't checked the Greek.--Jdavid2008 06:54, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Matthew 5:3-12

I am wondering if perhaps "fortunate" is a better word then happy for this. Those people aren't necessarily happy I think. Does anybody have any ideas? Or how about "lucky"? or well off? --Jdavid2008 07:17, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Ditto. The root Greek word translated here as "happy" is makarion (in a different alphabet though, of course). It is generally translated "blessed" and speaks not of emotional feeling but of a gift from God. The Latin vulgate translation reads "felix" which means happy or lucky, but lucky has negative religious connotations for some people. If I were translating, I'd stick with the more traditional rendering "blessed" which is less likely to cause confusion. --Fontwords 17:44, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Ok, if anybody would have had a strong objection to us changing it they had plenty of time, and if they have good reasons they can still debate it. I'm going to go ahead and change it to blessed. Please join this conversation if you disagree.--Jdavid2008 17:20, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Matthew 9:38

Changed push to send for ἐκβάλῃ 03:29, 19 December 2007 --Jonathan Gallagher

[edit] Matthew 20-28

Added these chapters, but in a very raw form, since I I'll be travelling for a while and won't be able to get to this for some time. Thought it would be best to post this and leave the editing and formatting to others! Jonathan Gallagher 14:49, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Matthew 13-19

Added these chapters--need formatting. Jonathan Gallagher 22:40, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Matthew 15:18

The word translated here as "mind" is "kardias," literally "heart". Could we just translate it as "heart"? Fontwords 14:06, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Well, I guess I'll be bold now and amend mind to heart, seeing as I haven't heard any objections. Heart has the advantage of being more literal, and it still makes good sense in the culture of modern English. Fontwords 16:44, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

This raises a wider question than just this instance. In general the Biblical writers had their anatomy off somewhat. For them, your heart was where you did your thinking, your bowels where you did your feeling. However for us, it's the heart where you do your feeling, and your head/brain/mind where you do your thinking. This leads to some erroneous conclusions if we read heart as meaning emotions, when the Biblical writers were meaning thought. Here's the making of a good debate! Jonathan Gallagher 01:59, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Oh...maybe I should have thought through that one a bit more. Well, if you'd like to revert, feel free. Fontwords 16:34, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Matthew 5:5

This verse seems to have a mistake... "5 Blessed are the modest, Because they will inherit the earth." I think the standard translation is meek. That is a bit old English though, perhaps a better word would be submissive, yielding or something like that? --Jdavid2008 18:39, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Time to move to completed book status

Maybe it's time to move this to the completed book status, since all the chapters are done... Jonathan Gallagher 02:02, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Matthew 6:27

"add one foot to his height"? Really? I sincerely doubt it. The accepted meaning appears to be "add one moment to his lifespan", or similar. However, maybe the original did not have words for these terms, and so used length measurements instead, with the lifespan as the implied meaning. In this case, if we want to be more literal than actually saying "lifespan", we could use "add one measure to his length", to facilitate both readings. But "height" just seems wrong. --193.11.177.69 10:19, 12 October 2008 (UTC)