Mr. J. Griffiths I quite appreciate that point. What I am concerned about is that it sounds all right in this House but steps should be taken to see that that kind of balance is not given another interpretation elsewhere.
Mr. Sandys The financial authorities of the Federation, in the end, have to look at the whole of their expenditure together. Therefore, the fact that we are relieving them of certain expenditure which otherwise they would have to incur on defence, will enable them to devote greater resources to the development of these territories. The money we are providing for development is linked to the Borneo territories. It is not for the Federation of Malaysia as a whole. In addition—this was one of the things we sat up so late about—we secured agreement by Singapore to make a substantial loan to the Federation for the purpose of development in the Borneo territories.
The hon. Member for Leyton produced some powerful arguments against those who cast doubts on the popular support which exists for Malaysia, and who questioned whether it was wise to go ahead with this plan without further investigation of opinion. However, the hon. Member for Eton and Slough (Mr. Brockway) took a rather different view. I know he favours the idea of Malaysia, but he expressed doubts about the timing and questioned whether more effort should not be made to make sure that the people of these territories really wanted Malaysia and were ready for it.
He asked for some delay in bringing in the Federation, first because of his doubts about the existence of adequate popular support and, secondly, on the ground that it would be damaging to the relations with Indonesia, and possibly also the Philippines. I cannot accept that there are serious doubts about what he majority of the people want, nor do I believe that relations with Indonesia would be improved by appearing to hesitate and draw back at this last moment.
The hon. Member for Eton and Slough questioned whether there was adequate popular support, particularly in Sarawak. I think he recognised that there was a reasonable majority in favour in North Borneo, but he questioned whether in Sarawak this support existed. This new association is coming into being after very prolonged thought and discussion within the territories themselves, and between their Governments, and, as the right hon. Member for Wakefield pointed out, we have been thinking about this ourselves for quite a long time. It is, of course, a local initiative. On the other hand, as the right hon. Gentleman pointed out, we have thought for many years that this was a good solution. The fact that neither the Labour Government nor the present Government have publicly advocated this course was because we felt that it would stand a better chance if it grew out of a natural desire from the people on the spot, and was not given the appearance of an initiative taken here in London.
However, that does not mean that this is all just a last-minute conception. A great deal of thought has been going on. There has been a great deal of discussion between us and the Government in Malaya before this all came into the public Press. Nobody can reasonably suggest that this is an ill-considered plan.
I am convinced that the Federation has the backing of a majority of the peoples of all four territories. Since doubts have been expressed about the attitude of the peoples of North Borneo and Sarawak, and particularly Sarawak, I should remind the House of the extent of the consultations which took place. First, there was the Cobbold Commission which expressed the unanimous opinion that two-thirds of the population of both territories were in favour of Malaysia subject to proper safeguards, which I believe we have secured, and they seem to recognise that they are adequate. A little later, the Legislatures of both territories passed resolutions without a dissentient vote in favour of Malaysia. Both these Legislatures were subsequently dissolved and general elections were held. In both territories these elections have resulted in majorities for parties which support Malaysia. I think that is pretty conclusive.
The hon. Member for Eton and Slough said that he thought that whilst there might be a majority in Sarawak in favour of Malaysia, nonetheless there was probably a majority which favoured a plebiscite; or, at any rate, a part of the majority for Malaysia was not in favour of going straight into the Federation without holding a plebiscite beforehand. I do not think that is correct. I should like to explain what the position is. As the right hon. Member for Middlesbrough, East said, (he Alliance Party, which is in favour of Malaysia without a plebiscite, obtained 19 votes out of the 36
