terms of the limited ability to develop these facts? You know, give me a sense of their participation or their message to the President during the meeting.
A I would say they were generally supportive. Pat Cipollone certainly understood the situation and was trying to reinforce our arguments.
The chief of staff is not a lawyer, so—and he was very quick throughout this process to say, "Look, I'm not a lawyer, I don't know how this stuff works, you guys will figure this out," you know, whether that was in his office on the 29th or this day. So he recognized that he had, sort of, limited input on that issue. But Pat Cipollone was supportive.
Q Got it.
All right. Let me turn your attention now to a second meeting that you have with Mr. Clark—that you and Mr. Rosen have with Mr. Clark.
Is there another contentious discussion face-to-face, Mr. Donoghue, between you, Jeff Rosen, and Jeff Clark at the SCIF on the sixth floor at the Department of Justice on January the 2nd?
A Yes. That was in the afternoon.
Q All right. Tell us, what was the impetus for calling—who called it, and what was the reason for that meeting?
A So the first meeting was on the 28th. That was Monday. This is the following Saturday. I had intended to be at the office that afternoon because we had a 1 o'clock call with DOD and other partners relating to preparation for January 6th.
I didn't know if the DAG was going to do that call from his office or from home. got in to the Justice Department probably around 12:30, quarter to 1:00, shortly before the call, and I went to the DAG's office. I saw he was there.
He said that he had spoken to Jeff Clark and that Jeff Clark told him, apparently
