User talk:Mpaa

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(Archives index, Last archive) Welcome

Hello, Mpaa, and welcome to Wikisource! Thank you for joining the project. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

Carl Spitzweg 021-detail.jpg

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Add the code {{active projects}}, {{PotM}} or {{CotW}} to your page for current wikisource projects.

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I hope you enjoy contributing to Wikisource, the library that is free for everyone to use! In discussions, please "sign" your comments using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your IP address (or username if you're logged in) and the date. If you need help, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question here (click edit) and place {{helpme}} before your question.

Again, welcome! — billinghurst sDrewth 12:00, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

PSM Volume 17[edit]

Many thanks for your help in cleaning up this and the previous volumes.— Ineuw talk

Hi, I've just finished proofreading Volume 25. So much easier with your clean-up, compared to Volume 24. Is there any chance you could do your wizardry on further volumes? Cheers, Zoeannl (talk) 11:47, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, happy to know it was useful. I'll try. Not in the short term though.--Mpaa (talk) 14:27, 27 October 2014 (UTC)
BTW, Vol 28 is cleaned up already, if you are interested.--Mpaa (talk) 19:36, 28 October 2014 (UTC)
And Vol 29 on its way.--Mpaa (talk) 21:08, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

TOC err[edit]

Hello, Mpaa. I noticed that the poems listed from Part I on Page:Love Songs.djvu/16 do not show up in the Mainspace. I was going to validate, but I'm not sure how to fix the problem. Thanks! Londonjackbooks (talk) 05:07, 12 November 2014 (UTC)

Similar issue with Helen of Troy and Other Poems. Londonjackbooks (talk) 15:08, 12 November 2014 (UTC)

Pasted on Help page as I cannot figure it out.--Mpaa (talk) 19:33, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
Find out the fix (after many attempts ...). Thanks for pointing out.--Mpaa (talk) 20:20, 12 November 2014 (UTC)

The Tsar's Window Four Leaf Clover[edit]

Help:Adding images mentions Imagemagick, which could be used to get rid of the paper texture of the four leaf clover and the horseshoe that ate illustrations used in the No Name series novel The Tsar's Window. By the way, how good are you with images? --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 12:27, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

I can do that single image for you, if you wish.— Ineuw talk 15:47, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Yes please. I need to reinstall tools as I changed PC.--Mpaa (talk) 21:33, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Hi. I did that and everything else on the volume, and placed it in the queue for validation. — Ineuw talk 21:39, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
Thanks.--Mpaa (talk) 18:34, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Bot fixes[edit]

Thank you for the bot header fixes to Ninety-three. Londonjackbooks (talk) 22:37, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

You're Welcome.--Mpaa (talk) 10:24, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

Database reports[edit]

Hello again,

I could not think of anyone better to ask since most of it seems to be .py based -- is there any way we can start our own centralized Database reporting like Wikipedia has? Having such a repository would go a long way in selecting maintenance tasks to completion.

If that is too big of a deal to start-up -- either without group discussion taking place first or is just too labor intensive & the like -- can you just get one database up and running?

I'm interested in the Gadget usage section in particular (note that the first half of results are faux deviations of the true results found in the bottom half of the same table). Thanks for any input/reply in advance. -- George Orwell III (talk) 00:06, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Hi. I guess I would need an access on tool labs to start with or we could use User:Wikisource-bot (@John Vandenberg:, what do you say?). I am not familiar with the libraries used in the .py example, I am checking if I can use pywikibot instead. I would need help with SQL queries (or I could copy them from wikipedia reports) . Parsing the outcome, generating the reports and updating the pages should not be an issue.--Mpaa (talk) 19:22, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
This might be of interest in the meantime:
Bye--Mpaa (talk) 20:20, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
Requested access in the meantime.--Mpaa (talk) 22:56, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
Happy to have you onboard with wikisource-bot. Do you have an account on toollabs? FWIW, that is exactly the sorts of purpose that I see for WS-bot. — billinghurst sDrewth 02:43, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
Just made one. I am understanding what to do next ... :-) --Mpaa (talk) 08:14, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
@George Orwell III:, I have now access to the database. I tried to run that query but it gives me errors (ERROR 1146 (42S02): Table 'enwiki_p.user_properties_anonym' doesn't exist). Maybe something has changed somewhere.--Mpaa (talk) 12:40, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
Pointing at enwiki_p.user_properties does not yield any result, even though up_property='gadget-xxx' should be OK according to the docs.--Mpaa (talk) 17:43, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

You know this stuff is beyond my skill set but the only thing that leaps out at me is read_default_file='~/.my.cnf' ; looks like some sort of configuration file. Otherwise, we need to hunt down User:MZMcBride and ask him what might be wrong with his .py script. -- George Orwell III (talk) 01:07, 9 December 2014 (UTC)

We can ping the delightful @MZMcBride: otherwise mpaa or I can grab him in IRC. — billinghurst sDrewth 04:04, 9 December 2014 (UTC)
Please pardon my throwing another oar into this boat but for what it is worth '~/.my.cnf' normally only carries items like default mySQL login id, database, host (and optionally password) to use for a connection. As the filename format is "UNIX" I imagine it might have to be remapped for queries launched from a Windows host.

Second thought: might the table you are looking for be enwikisource_p.user_properties, rather than enwiki_p.user_properties*?

Bear in mind these suggestions are coming from even less background than any of you guys. 04:42, 9 December 2014 (UTC) (Bugger. Trying to be neat and logging out of Quarry clearly logs you out of all WMF projects. Anyway, was me. AuFCL (talk) 04:50, 9 December 2014 (UTC)

my.cnf (yes, it is the info on dB/login) is not an issue, I can access the dB. Both enwiki_p and enwikisource_p show consistent results, but "gadget-xxx" properties are not there.--Mpaa (talk) 12:32, 9 December 2014 (UTC)
I am afraid none of the following is necessarily useful to you but in hopes it might prompt a line of enquiry…

I tried installing the Gadgets extension on a private mediawiki installation and then further imported the pilcrowMarkers gadget (on the basis of its extreme simplicity.) To nobody's surprise a new up_property now appears in user_properties, viz:

mysql> SELECT * FROM user_properties WHERE (up_property LIKE 'gadget-%') AND (up_user IN (SELECT user_id FROM USER WHERE user_name='WikiSysop'));
| up_user | up_property           | up_value |
|       2 | gadget-pilcrowMarkers | 1        |
1 ROW IN SET (0.00 sec)
Now this of course is using an operator set with unlimited local access, and of course as you already know performing an equivalent operation on enwikisource_p.user_properties reveals no gadget-* up_properties whatsoever.
Could your problems be a consequence of well-meant access restrictions on enwikisource/enwikisource_p (after all these are in fact real-world user attribute tables)? Just a thought.
Regrettably apart from offering sympathy I am not sure any of this will be of the slightest use to you. AuFCL (talk) 08:30, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
Long story short: privacy concerns make the info not available after the migration from toolserver. Still pending but not likely to be closed shortly. Details in phabricator report T60196 .--Mpaa (talk) 21:17, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
Ah, I see. What a load of nonsense at any rate. Thanks for looking into it nevertheless. -- George Orwell III (talk) 22:24, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
Oh, my, giddy, aunt that Phabricator report makes depressing reading. Nobody even seems to comprehend which parts survive the existing filter and which parts (if any!) have been sighted (I am betting none) by legal. Oh, well roll on mediawiki++. At least I now know I got my SQL experiments at least as right as the "experts" did. AuFCL (talk) 04:23, 12 December 2014 (UTC)
Yes, your help was appreciated, it shed some light.--Mpaa (talk) 10:49, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

Any useful reports at all[edit]

Hi again,

Along the same line of investigation as in the above section (where security concerns trump report generation apparently) I'm assuming User: preference settings other than Gadget selections can't be "polled" either?

Assuming "yes" - can we move on and at least run something like this grep script claims to detect (i.e. any instance of the usage of deprecated javascript)? -- George Orwell III (talk) 00:30, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

What I can see is the following:
[enwikisource_p]> SELECT up_property, COUNT(*) FROM user_properties GROUP BY up_property;
| up_property    | COUNT(*) |
| disablemail    |     1864 |
| fancysig       |      850 |
| gender         |     1819 |
| LANGUAGE       |     1478 |
| nickname       |     2165 |
| skin           |   124924 |
| timecorrection |     7423 |
| variant        |     3438 |
but it is not clear to me what would you like me to grep and where.
Should I grep for instances of deprecated javascript in here?--Mpaa (talk) 17:58, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
If that is what you needed, I got this:
USER@pc:~/python/core {master}$ grep -n -f deprecated.ids *.js
Common.js:277:	a.onclick=FUNCTION(){insertTags('', this.title, '');RETURN FALSE;};
Common.js:353:	importScriptURI( mw.config.get( 'wgScript' ) + '?title=MediaWiki:Geonotice.js&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript&maxage=3600&ver=2');
Common.js_watchlist.js:55:	importScriptURI( mw.config.get( 'wgScript' ) + '?title=MediaWiki:Geonotice.js&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript&maxage=3600&ver=2');
Dictionary.js:62:	var api=sajax_init_object();
Gadget-LongEditSummaries.js:37:	addHandler(wpSummary, "keyup", adjustMaxLength)
Gadget-LongEditSummaries.js:38:	addHandler(wpSummary, "change", adjustMaxLength)
Gadget-TemplatePreloader.js:4:	/*global mw, $, sajax_init_object */
Gadget-TemplatePreloader.js:223:	// FIXME: USE OF "sajax_init_object" IS deprecated. Sajax IS deprecated, USE jQuery.ajax OR mediawiki.api instead.
Gadget-TemplatePreloader.js:224:	var request = sajax_init_object();
Gadget-UserMessages.js:87:	//akeytt IS deprected AND does nothing. who cares about access KEYS anyhow.
Gadget-UserMessages.js:94:	akeytt();*/

Let me backup a bit & clarify -- after the above quest for gadget usage per User: preference settings went nowhere (section above this one), I was hoping to at least gather User: preference settings just for the Preferences/Edit tab. After looking "around" a bit on that particular note, it seemed safe to surmise the same security roadblock for Gadgets would make further inquiries for building 'Edit' tab stat report(s) a moot point as well (am I wrong?)

Moving on, I switched to seeing what -- if any -- deprecated javascript functions I could find in a.) local site scripts, b.) imported site scripts, and finally c.) User scripts.

Nothing well thought out here I'm sorry to say -- George Orwell III (talk) 21:27, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

I think the above should be your point a) then, point b) I have no clue where to look for, point c) one could look for all *.js subpages in user namespace?--Mpaa (talk) 08:53, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
If you are interested I can send you the result of grep on (most of) point c).--Mpaa (talk) 20:43, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
Might as well -- better have it available for when the opportunity presents itself.

I just took a stab at refreshing MediaWiki:Gadget-LongEditSummaries.js (which was already deprecated/moot for anybody still using it) so I'm curious to see if anything changes. -- George Orwell III (talk) 22:20, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

Left it here: User:George_Orwell_III/sandbox_js.--Mpaa (talk) 21:04, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Mining data from the quarry[edit]

Hi, and thanks for the link to the data query page and the link to the database schemas. Managed to modify and run my query (it was written for MySQL and the current database is dbMaria), but I got some unrelated categories and garbage, which means that the category links are incorrectly defined in the SQL statement. I'll keep at it which also means I have delve into the SQL of dbMaria which is a bit different that MySQL. Must assume that the switch to the new DBSM was because Oracle owns MySQL. — Ineuw talk 00:07, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Welcome. I am no expert on databases but I use MySQL workbench to connect to dB (if this can be useful to you).--Mpaa (talk) 19:28, 7 January 2015 (UTC)
Yes it is useful and I will reinstall it. I used to use that a long time ago, (6 years) but that is not the problem.. . . I removed the relational constraints to the categorylinks, and ran a simple "SELECT" query to see if it can select just the titles. There are nearly 6000 titles in the PSM main namespace and it selected only about 2,200. When you have the chance, could you run this simple query for PSM article titles for the main namespace?
Like ('Popular_Science_Monthly%')
AND = 0

Ineuw talk 19:57, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Same here, weird ...:
MariaDB [enwikisource_p]> SELECT COUNT(*) FROM WHERE  LIKE ('Popular_Science_Monthly/%s') AND = 0;
| COUNT(*) |
|     2206 |
1 ROW IN SET (0.01 sec)
OK, I got it. It should be something wrong in the LIKE specs. %s must discar something(apostrphes?, unicode? whatever ...?)
MariaDB [enwikisource_p]> SELECT COUNT(*)  FROM WHERE  LIKE ('Popular_Science_Monthly%') AND = 0;
| COUNT(*) |
|     8933 |
1 ROW IN SET (0.01 sec)

--Mpaa (talk) 21:08, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks. I will figure out what's going on from the 2nd recordset — Ineuw talk 21:12, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Hi again, using the 2nd SQL statement, I extracted all the titles and everything matches up to my Access database (8016). The additional entries are all redirects pointing to Obituaries and Articles - but without the {{ROOTPAGENAME}}. of PSM.
The issue is to check the link to the categories by testing some records of "categorylink" layout because my original copy of the SQL statement from 2 years ago mentions a fieldname link which no longer exists, or rather it has been renamed. It is just a matter of some detective work.
The lazy way is to print the field lists of each table in question from MariaDB, extract a few complete records from each, recreate the structures in MSAccess and see what I get. I have used MSAccess as a query design tool (very sophisticated, the best I've ever come across) and as a graphical front end to connect to MySQL. The two basic SQL differences that I remember is that MSAccess uses '*' instead of '%' to indicate everything, and 'constant strings' in a MYSQL statement can only be enclosed with single quotes, while MSAccess accepts both single or double qutes. P.S.: I always wondered who is/was Maria. — Ineuw talk 04:12, 11 January 2015 (UTC)
I think the issue is in the search pattern. This should do the trick.
    enwikisource_p.categorylinks ON = enwikisource_p.categorylinks.cl_from
WHERE REGEXP 'Popular_Science_Monthly/Volume_.*'
        AND = 0;
Bye--Mpaa (talk) 09:40, 11 January 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. I created and executed a similar statement successfully which resulted in an accurate list of the titles, but no categories. After studying the schema, I concluded that the categories table is missing from the SQL. The original of this query created a temporary table with the article titles and the link # and then linked this to the categories.
USE enwikisource_p;
SELECT, categorylinks.cl_to
 FROM categorylinks INNER JOIN
  ON = categorylinks.cl_from WHERE categorylinks.cl_to LIKE
  ('Popular_Science_Monthly_Volume%') AND page.page_namespace = 0;

Ineuw talk 20:17, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Finally got it[edit]

Extracted the structure of each table and then extracted a couple of 100 records from each table and figured out what is happening and how the info is stored. Below is the correct SQL statement - yielded some 27,000 records. :-). Thanks again for your guidance. BTW, SQL is easier than it looks, only the table JOINs are a bit tricky.

USE enwikisource_p;
SELECT page.page_title, categorylinks.cl_to
 FROM categorylinks INNER JOIN page
  ON page.page_id = categorylinks.cl_from WHERE page.page_title LIKE
  ('Popular_Science_Monthly_Volume%') AND page.page_namespace = 0;

Ineuw talk 16:43, 21 January 2015 (UTC)

Good. I think the JOIN statement is in this case symmetric, so it should be equivalent to the above. I also got 27000+ pages.
The syntax for asymmetric JOIN is where I am a bit weak but if you really want to get comfortable, use the MSAccess query designer to create asymmetric JOIN. It's the best visual designer I've seen anywhere, and the SQL is easy to convert to MariaDB. — Ineuw talk 05:45, 22 January 2015 (UTC)

New Proposal Notification - Replacement of common main-space header template[edit]

Announcing the listing of a new formal proposal recently added to the Scriptorium community-discussion page, Proposals section, titled:

Switch header template foundation from table-based to division-based

The proposal entails the replacement of the current Header template familiar to most with a structurally redesigned new Header template. Replacement is a needed first step in series of steps needed to properly address the long time deficiencies behind several issues as well as enhance our mobile device presence.

There should be no significant operational or visual differences between the existing and proposed Header templates under normal usage (i.e. Desktop view). The change is entirely structural -- moving away from the existing HTML all Table make-up to an all Div[ision] based one.

Please examine the testcases where the current template is compared to the proposed replacement. Don't forget to also check Mobile Mode from the testcases page -- which is where the differences between current header template & proposed header template will be hard to miss.

For those who are concerned over the possible impact replacement might have on specific works, you can test the replacement on your own by entering edit mode, substituting the header tag {{header with {{header/sandbox and then previewing the work with the change in place. Saving the page with the change in place should not be needed but if you opt to save the page instead of just previewing it, please remember to revert the change soon after your done inspecting the results.

Your questions or comments are welcomed. At the same time I personally urge participants to support this proposed change. -- George Orwell III (talk) 02:04, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

{{nop}} vs <nowiki />'s[edit]


What is reason to use {{nop}} rather than <nowiki /> in pagebreaks? As for me, it looks equally on HTML and on epub, but the latter doesn’t spoil plain text with any html-tags, and it’s used in French Wikisource.

And what is this? Is this inclusion of a couple of pages really needed? For me, it looks like a trash.

Best regards, Nonexyst (talk) 21:29, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

That is what is the recommended way here to break pages, see Help:Formatting_conventions. If you think that should be the good way, I encourage you to post it here Wikisource:Scriptorium. As far as the page above, that is a mistake, will fix it. A mistake might happen, call it a trash sounds a bit harsh. Was just trying to be helpful, in the future I'll stay away ...--Mpaa (talk) 21:51, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
Well, maybe, I’ll propose it there. Sorry if it sounds harsh, I’m not a native English speaker, so it can raise some misunderstading.Nonexyst (talk) 22:09, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

PSM Obituary Notes[edit]

Ciao. There are anchors placed in the Obituary Notes section of this page. Can you recall where they are anchored to? Ineuw (talk) 02:11, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

By context may I hazard a guess: Popular Science Monthly/Volume 38/December 1890/The Identity of Light and Electricity 07:14, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
Not really, Mpaa started to organize something and the topic ended up as a major discussion in the Scriptorium about creating a separate section for obituaries. My only contribution was that obits in PSM appear everywhere (any section), otherwise I wasn't involved and don't know what happened to it. Ineuw (talk) 09:24, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
In this page: Author:Heinrich Hertz: Obituary in "Obituary Notes", in Popular Science Monthly Volume 44, April 1894--Mpaa (talk) 18:09, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Mpaa, (I should have clicked on the link). But, there are two problems: The other end of the anchor is directed back to the Obituary section but not to the paragraph, and the index of this volume also contains an obit section for which the anchor is generated automatically. I guess my only option is to use two anchors. Ineuw (talk) 05:27, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Found it, Popular Science Monthly/Volume 44/April 1894/Obituary: Heinrich Rudolf Hertz. There was some debate about this. Proceed as you think is better, I will not oppose if you decide to change the approach.--Mpaa (talk) 07:43, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. I will figure something out when I do the indexes with obituaries. Ineuw (talk) 18:03, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

A definition[edit]

The is no greater humbling experience than that of revisiting one's old proofreading. Ineuw (talk) 05:26, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

 :-)--Mpaa (talk) 12:08, 2 March 2015 (UTC)
By the way, the pages I worked on yesterday in Volume 35 were for demo purposes for Zoeannl. Ineuw (talk) 18:10, 2 March 2015 (UTC)