Template talk:Greek

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In Wikipedia, see Template:GreekFont. Bob Burkhardt (talk) 17:34, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Now redirected to Template:Script/Greek. Library Guy (talk) 22:15, 21 December 2015 (UTC)


It looks like {{Polytonic}} does the same thing, but someone wants a template that just manipulates the "lang" while using the automatic font? Perhaps Polytonic should be chosen, but some bot work (mapping Polytonic usage to {{Greek}}) will need to be done to preserve the expected effect of existing usage first. If both are going to continue to be used to circumvent the auto font, the redirect makes sense. Library Guy (talk) 22:13, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

It has been my understanding that {{Greek}} marks the text as being in Greek, and {{Polytonic}} is intended to additionally override the font when polytonic orthography is used. For this reason, I use {{Polytonic}} in most works as the original is polytonic, but I would use {{Greek}} for modern Greek or, for example, in the "notes" parameter of headers where the Greek name of an author or the Greek title of a work is to be specified.
That being said, I don't really know if that's the intended purpose of having two separate templates for Greek text. I like {{Polytonic}} because the font used looks much more similar to the font used in most works I have proofread for polytonic Greek text. —Beleg Tâl (talk) 14:58, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

Polytonic fonts in the Greek template[edit]

There seems to be inconsistencies the Greek template. There are several polytonic fonts in the Greek template and the behaviour is different on different PCs. See below, I have my sandbox page (User:DivermanAU/sandbox) showing the plain Greek alphabet and with Greek and polytonic templates. Screen shots shown below are taken from two different Windows 10 PCs showing the same sandbox page.

Greek and Polytonic Wikisource templates-compare.png

PC #2 shows the text with "Greek" template the same as 'polytonic" template, PC #1 does not.

@EncycloPetey: I've moved the discussion here. I'm trying to understand, if the "Greek" template is not meant to show polytonic fonts, why are there several polytonic fonts in the Greek template? All of the fonts in the "Polytonic fonts" template (Athena, Gentium, 'Palatino Linotype', 'Arial Unicode MS', 'Lucida Sans Unicode', 'Lucida Grande', Code2000) are also in the "Greek' template. As I've found, the "Greek" template does show polytonic fonts on some PCs. DivermanAU (talk) 22:59, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Probably because of confusion from past editors who did not know about the {{polytonic}} template, coupled with the fact that the majority of texts we host here use polytonic Greek. There is not reason that the Greek template cannot support a broad sense of Greek, but it is not required that it do so. It can be used to display non-polytonic (modern) Greek.
Since I do not use Windows10 on the PC that I use, I will not be able to see what you are talking about. The only difference I see in your images is the lack of serifs from one. Serifs are not a big issue. --EncycloPetey (talk) 23:29, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
I discovered by that removing the "Deja Vu Sans" fonts from PC #1 that text using the Greek template does display the same as the Polytonic template. I still maintain that "DejaVu Sans" font should be removed from the Greek template. Why would you want text using the Greek template to display text without serifs (like PC #1 and not PC #2)? DivermanAU (talk) 19:17, 8 April 2017 (UTC)
From my perspective: Why would you want to eliminate that option? --EncycloPetey (talk) 19:23, 8 April 2017 (UTC)
I support DivermanAU's removal of the "DejaVu Sans". I undid EncycloPetey's reversion mainly because there was no explanation, but now that I have done it, my Greek looks a lot better to me. I don't really understand Great Brightstar's font additions, but certainly the "DejaVu Sans" didn't help as far as I am concerned. Library Guy (talk) 18:49, 23 April 2017 (UTC)
You can adjust your own settings, if you like. Please do not force the decision on everyone else. Forcing serifs is not a solution. We want to provide all options, not just the ones with serifs. --EncycloPetey (talk) 20:54, 23 April 2017 (UTC)
If you don't want serifs, then why use a template anyway? Just use plain Greek text e.g. αβγδ. The current Greek template has a mixture of serif and non-serif fonts and should be cleaned up. I can't see the point of having the current Greek template that (a) has a mix of serif and non-serif fonts and (b) produces inconsistent results. DivermanAU (talk) 21:53, 27 April 2017 (UTC)
What is it with serifs? Why do you keep raising the issue of serifs? Serifs are not the purpose of this template or the Greek template. The purpose of this template is to support the extended system of characters needed for polytonic Ancient Greek. The purpose of the general Greek template is to ensure that modern (tonicless) Greek is supported. The templates are supposed to work with or without serifs, not to require serifs or to omit them. It's not about serifs. So please stop harping about serifs. --EncycloPetey (talk)
Re: serifs, the issue is that the some works, e.g. 1911 Encyclopædia Britannica, show Greek text with serifs. Using the Greek template means that sometimes Greek text will display with serifs (so the Wikisource version looks like the printed version) and sometimes won't (so the Wikisource version doesn't look like the printed version) depending on which fonts are installed. If the Greek template is meant to work with or without serifs, how do you make it show serifs reliably?The doco for the Greek template states it: "Automatically selects an appropriate font for Greek characters." So, what is deciding is "appropriate". DivermanAU (talk) 21:10, 5 July 2017 (UTC)
It checks which fonts are available on their browser, and chooses a font that can display tonal marks, based on the options in the template. If your personal browser is not displaying things the way you want, you can adjust your browser settings. Please stop harping about serifs. --EncycloPetey (talk) 22:16, 5 July 2017 (UTC)